Greece Bailout Coming

[leistb]

Greece should get EU support for pledges-Almunia
Tue Feb 9, 2010 11:35am EST

(http://thisbluemarble.com/finance/bonds)
By Marcin Grajewski (http://blogs.reuters.com/search/journalist.php?edition=us&n=marcin.grajewski&) and Jan Strupczewski (http://blogs.reuters.com/search/journalist.php?edition=us&n=jan.strupczewski&)





BRUSSELS, Feb 9 (Reuters) - European Union leaders should tell Greece on Thursday that it will receive the bloc's support in exchange for clear budget commitments, EU Economic and Monetary Affairs Commissioner Joaquin Almunia said on Tuesday.

EU leaders meet on Thursday in Brussels and are likely to discuss the difficult budgetary situation of Greece amid growing market concern that Athens may not be able to service its debts.

Euro zone and Greek assets recovered some poise on Tuesday as markets bet the European Union was on the verge of taking steps to restore confidence in struggling members like Greece.

Almunia's words were the nearest Brussels' policymakers have gone to suggesting the bloc could actively support Athens.

"I would like the leaders of Europe to say to the Greek authorities that in exchange for the efforts you are making, you are going to get support from us," Almunia told the European Parliament on what was his last day in office.

"You don't get support for free. That would simply lay the foundations for further imbalances and crisis. We have got instruments to provide that in exchange for clear commitments that they will meet their responsibilities," Almunia said.

Greece has pledged to reduce its budget deficit to below 3 percent in 2012 from 12.7 percent in 2009 after ratings downgrades which pushed Greek yields to record highs.

"What I would like to see this (European) Council producing is a clear demand on all member states, starting with Greece, that they meeting their obligations and put into practice those measures they committed themselves to carrying out," Almunia said in the French city of Strasbourg.

Almunia warned that Greek problems were a common concern for the euro zone. Spain and Portugal, which also have large deficits and face popular opposition to cost cutting, have also seen their yields rise in a spill-over effect of market worries.

"The difficult situation in Greece is a matter of common concern for the euro area ... There is serious risk of spill over to other parts of the euro area," Almunia said.

He said the executive European Commission fully supported Greece's fiscal cuts programme, but noted the plan carried risks, such as worse economic growth than expected or insufficient tax revenues.

Greece must therefore be ready for additional fiscal cuts.

"There are risks to the programme targets ... the macroeconomic scenario is rather optimistic," he said.

He said that to regain economic competitiveness, Greece must pass an ambitious package of structural reforms including those on the pension and health care systems, and make its labour market more flexible.
(Reporting by Marcin Grajewsk and Jan Strupczewski, editing by Dale Hudson)

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSLDE6182B020100209

[Ross]

More likely is a lot of talk about a bailout by people who do not actually
have to part with the money .

[leistb]

More likely is a lot of talk about a bailout by people who do not actually
have to part with the money .

Agreed. I may have posted this prematurely. I just can't think of a way to contain the worms once the can is open if they were to be bailed out.

[Ought Six]

Greece CDS costs fall on reports on aid (http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSN0910023120100209)


Reuters
Tue Feb 9, 2010


NEW YORK -- The cost to insure the debt of Greece dropped after reports said euro zone countries have decided in principle to support the debt-stricken nation.

Credit default swaps on Greece's debt tightened to 369 basis points, or $369,000 per year to insure $10 million for five years, from 416 basis points earlier on Tuesday, according to CMA DataVision.
_____

(Reporting by Karen Brettell; Editing by Chizu Nomiyama)

[BirdGuano]

Must be some delay in figuring out which Cayman bank to run the Euro bond sales through.

:rofl:

[Ought Six]

Greek Civil Servants Strike Over Austerity Measures (http://www.nytimes.com/2010/02/11/world/europe/11greece.html)


DAN BILEFSKY and NIKI KITSANTONIS
The New York Times
February 11, 2010


http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2010/02/10/world/10cnd-greece2/10cnd-greece2-articleLarge.jpg


ATHENS — Striking civil servants brought public services to a halt across Greece on Wednesday, in a largely peaceful one-day protest against the tough austerity measures officials have said are necessary to stave off a mounting financial crisis.

Greece has been under intense pressure from other members of the European Union to cut its huge budget deficit and is in danger of failing to refinance some $28 billion in debt coming due in April and May. Fears of default in Greece and other struggling European countries have roiled financial markets around the world in recent weeks.

But the Greek government’s proposals for deep spending cuts to rein in the deficit have met significant resistance.

“We won’t pay for their crisis!” loudspeakers blared from Klafthmonos Square, otherwise known as “the square of the crying people,” where disenchanted Greek workers have come for centuries to express their discontent. “Not one euro to be sacrificed to the bankers!”

In Greece, commentators said the economic problems had exposed a general ignorance about the harsh realities of the global economy, while laying bare the strong sense of entitlement in a country where one out of three Greeks is employed in a civil service that guarantees jobs for life.

“People in other countries like Germany, France and the United States learned about the workings of the economy the hard way, by seeing their jobs on the line,” said Babis Papadimitriou, an economic analyst at the Skai radio and television group. “This hasn’t been the case in Greece.”

But relatively modest public demonstrations Wednesday — one in the square and another nearby — were tinged with a sense of resignation that megaphones were no match for volatile financial markets.

Indeed, even many of those protesting said they realized they needed to make sacrifices, or risk falling over what Prime Minister George Papandreou, a Socialist, called the “edge of the cliff” last week. Others expressed hope that the European Union would rescue their proud democracy from becoming the next Iceland.

“We feel humiliated and we understand that things cannot remain the same as they were before,” said Vasiliki Revithi, 56, a biochemist at the National Organization for Medicines, noting that a monthly cut of about $950 to her salary would mean no new car and cheaper makeup. “But we gave the world democracy, and we expect the European Union to support us.”

The crisis in Greece is a credibility test for the euro zone, the 16-nation bloc where a one-size-fits-all monetary policy has underlined the challenges of managing disparate economies during an economic downturn. Last week, the anxieties spread to Portugal and Spain, where investors increasingly fear that bloated budgets will not be slimmed. Late last year, Greece stunned investors by saying that its government deficit would be 12.7 percent of its gross domestic product, not the 3.7 percent the previous government had forecast earlier.

The government of Mr. Papandreou appears determined, however belatedly, to challenge a national consensus in which the state has been expected to provide for its citizens from cradle to grave.

“We are ready to take any necessary measures to make sure the deficit goal is met,” he said after meeting with the French president, Nicolas Sarkozy, on Wednesday.

The government has announced $2.75 billion in public spending cuts. It also aims to raise another $6.87 billion from new taxes and measures aimed at fighting tax evasion, which analysts said deprived the federal budget of $44.2 billion last year. It has frozen salaries, increased the average retirement age among men and women to 63 by 2015 and introducing a higher gas tax.

While the changes have hardly been embraced, analysts said they believed that Wednesday’s strikes would not expand into widespread social unrest, provided that the government’s austerity measures produced results. The measures have been approved by the two main political parties. Passage appears certain in Parliament, where the Socialists hold more than half the seats.

Yannis Stournaras, director of the Greek Foundation for Economic and Industrial Research, a leading economic analysis group, argued that a majority of Greeks realized that the future of the country was at stake.

“Greeks would rather see their wages reduced for a few years than to lose their deposits at the bank,” he said. “No one wants for the country to commit suicide.”

He also expressed cautious optimism that European Union leaders, who are to meet Thursday in Brussels to discuss Greece’s economic woes, would not allow the country to default because the credibility of the euro zone as a whole was at stake.

“If the markets turn bad and deprive Greece of liquidity, we can end up with another Lehman Brothers in which the failure of a coordinated response led to collapse,” Mr. Stournaras said. “It will open a Pandora’s Box. The question is who would be next, a small country or a big country. If it’s a big country, then the euro will be in big trouble. I don’t believe European leaders will allow this to happen.”

Analysts said that Mr. Papandreou was determined not to be the first Greek prime minister since World War II to bring the country to economic disaster.

But whatever the political will, however, some economists cautioned that Greece remained at the mercy of investors. Michalis Massourakis, chief economist at a major bank in Athens, Alpha Bank, said the government’s austerity measures — and the tepid response from Brussels thus — had not been sufficiently swift to ease jittery investors.

Noting that the government needed to balance the need for swift action with public sentiment, he added, “The government’s reforms have not kept up with the expectations of the market, because this is not something that can happen in a democracy.”

[leistb]

www.stratfor.com (http://www.stratfor.com)

Stratfor
---------------------------

BRIEF: THE GREEK ECONOMIC SITUATION AND EUROPE

Applying STRATFOR analysis to breaking news Feb. 10 has seen a flurry of confirmations and denials from a number of European and German officials about the possible Greek bailout. That said, the level of chatter seems to indicate that some sort of German or German-led assistance package is in the works, although it seems that Berlin has not yet decided what it will look like. French government official Luc Chatel said in Paris today that the French government was also "busy working" on possible solutions for Greece and that French President Nicolas Sarkozy plans to hold a joint press conference with German Chancellor Angela Merkel after a Feb. 11 meeting of EU officials in Brussels. The Feb. 11 meeting, called by new EU President Herman Van Rompuy, is aimed at discussing economic reform and the need for "economic government" within the European Union. Sarkozy first proposed the idea of "economic government" within the eurozone in October 2008, but Berlin shot the idea down. It seems that the trouble in Greece might have changed Berlin's mind about such a proposal, which would be a significant about-face.

Copyright 2010 Stratfor.

[Ought Six]

Europe Closing in on Plan for Averting Greek Crisis (http://www.nytimes.com/2010/02/11/business/global/11union.html)


STEPHEN CASTLE and NICHOLAS KULISH
The New York Times
February 11, 2010


BRUSSELS — Facing a crucial test for the credibility of their common currency, European leaders were close to agreement Wednesday on moves aimed at persuading jittery bond market investors that Greece would not be allowed to default on its government debt.

Ahead of a summit meeting Thursday of the heads of all 27 E.U. governments in Brussels, the 16 euro zone finance ministers, joined by the president of the European Central Bank, Jean-Claude Trichet, concluded in a conference call Wednesday that action would have to be taken there to reassure the markets.

“The point of no return has been passed,” said one diplomat involved in the negotiations. “We have to do something or announce something.”

But whether the government in Athens should be offered loan guarantees or given additional loans to help meet its looming payment, or whether there should be a pledge to buy Greek government bonds should the need arise, still had not been firmly decided by Wednesday night, officials said.

Some officials said that the summit meeting might achieve little more than a political statement, leaving details to be worked out later by finance ministers.

German officials also insisted that no formal decision had been made. But a consensus was forming that Berlin and Paris would have to take the lead in resolving the debt crisis facing the euro.

President Nicolas Sarkozy of France and Chancellor Angela Merkel of Germany intend to hold a joint news conference after the summit meeting.

It is “no longer considered an option not to act,” one official in Paris said.

But officials also worried that any solution for the situation in Greece risked encouraging the markets to attack other euro zone countries that are regarded as weak links in the chain, starting with Portugal.

And there were questions about how to apply any commitments so that the weaker governments remained under pressure to press ahead with painful economic overhauls. Discussions on Wednesday also focused on whether all euro zone nations or just a few should participate in any rescue plan.

One of the key problems confronting the E.U. leaders, who meet Thursday morning in the elegant surroundings of the Bibliothèque Solvay, is the expectation among investors that a far-reaching set of measures will be announced.

“At this junction they will have to support Greece,” said Simon Tilford, chief economist at the Center for European Reform. “If you have encouraged the markets to believe that support is forthcoming and then it is not, we will see a backlash and Greek debt being sold and spreads rising.” He referred to the spread in yields, or premiums, over safer German debt required by investors to take on more risk.

Though Mr. Tilford said the markets would ideally like to see some form of guarantee being extended to Greek loans, he added that this would probably be too much for the government in Berlin. The most likely outcome was a loan facility extended on condition that domestic changes were undertaken by the government in Athens. It would also need to apply to other countries facing similar problems.

The European Commission says it has the treaty power to take action against nations that break their economic policy pledges.

Jean Pisani-Ferry, director of the Bruegel research institute in Brussels said it was important to lay out the ground rules so the markets could understand how aid would be given. He added that he would expect to learn “what form assistance would take, what would trigger it and who would provide it.”

The summit meeting Thursday was called by Herman Van Rompuy, president of the European Council, to try to draw up a longer-term economic strategy for the Union to modernize its economy by 2020, an agenda that has been overshadowed by the euro zone debt crisis.

The German government continued to insist Wednesday that no bailout package had been settled upon. “There has been no decision on such assistance, and there is none pending,” said a government official in Berlin. “We see no risk of default at this time.”

But as word continued to leak out about the negotiations over how to structure a package to help the struggling Greek government, it was clear that Germany was preparing to act in conjunction with other E.U. members. The only question remained how to do so without breaking E.U. law or stirring outrage among German taxpayers who do not want to foot the bill for what is viewed in Germany as Greek profligacy.

Peter Bofinger, professor of economics at the University of Würzburg and a member of the German government’s independent council of economic experts, said that the council has recommended that the Union give guarantees for newly issued government bonds from a country in Greece’s predicament, once it had presented a workable plan for getting its finances in order.

After the European government helped stabilize financial institutions during the crisis, Mr. Bofinger said, it was important to send a signal that traders for such institutions would not be allowed to turn around and break the currency union.

The German government has to tread carefully. Domestic opposition to joining the euro and abandoning the beloved deutsche mark was based on concerns that less responsible countries would look to Germany for handouts at the first sign of trouble.

“If the German government would just transfer money to Greece, people in Germany would feel their worst fears had come true,” said Thomas Mayer, chief economist at Deutsche Bank.

The pressure Mrs. Merkel’s government finds itself under was apparent in a statement by the coalition partners in her government, the Free Democrats, that there should be “no direct financial help for Greece.” Otherwise, said Oliver Luksic, the Free Democrats’ spokesman for European politics, “it would send the absolutely wrong signal to other euro countries, that no country has to strain to save any more.”

But Daniel Gros, director of the Center for European Policy Studies in Brussels, said that other countries are counting on Germany to lead the way out of a crisis that is no longer just about Greece but has turned into a larger threat to the solidarity of the euro zone. “The Germans are the only ones with deep pockets,” he said.

Meanwhile, stocks rose across most of Europe, with the euro-zone benchmark Dow Jones Euro Stoxx 50 index gaining 1.2 percent Wednesday. But the euro slipped as on-again off-again comments from European leaders showed the bloc was still moving hesitantly toward concrete measures. The 16-nation currency traded at 1.3733 late Wednesday in Europe, down from $1.3797 late Tuesday.

Greek government debt rallied for a second day in a row, with the yield on the government’s benchmark 10-year bond — which spiked as high as 7.2 percent on Jan. 28 — dropping at one point below 6.0 percent for the first time in a month. Italian, Irish, Spanish and Portuguese bonds also gained.

The cost of insuring government debts against default through credit default swaps also fell.

Charles Diebel, head of European rate strategy at Nomura International, said a default was not imminent in Greece. But without E.U. support Greek bond yields will rise so high that Athens will find it very difficult to sell debt when it needs to refinance in a few months.

“It’s a question of confidence, not fundamentals,” Mr. Diebel said. “They can’t just do it for Greece, either,” he added, “because otherwise the market will just start gunning for Portugal.”
_____

Nicholas Kulish reported from Berlin. David Jolly and Katrin Bennhold in Paris and Judy Dempsey in Berlin contributed reporting.

[DReynolds]

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/EU-leaders-reach-deal-to-rb-4068581329.html?x=0&sec=topStories&pos=main&asset=&ccode=

EU leaders reach deal to rescue Greece

On Thursday February 11, 2010, 7:23 am
By Marcin Grajewski and Jan Strupczewski

BRUSSELS (Reuters) - European leaders have reached a deal to provide aid to Greece, EU president Herman Van Rompuy said on Thursday, in an unprecedented move to stave off a broader crisis in the 16-nation bloc that shares the euro.

"There is an agreement on the Greek situation. We will communicate now the agreement to the other leaders," van Rompuy told reporters gathered at an EU leaders' summit.

The agreement was forged in talks between Van Rompuy, European Commission President Jose Manuel Barroso, French President Nicolas Sarkozy, German Chancellor Angela Merkel, European Central Bank President Jean-Claude Trichet and Greek Prime Minister George Papandreou.

Polish Prime Minister Donald Tusk told reporters earlier that the aid, which would amount to the first bailout of a euro zone members since the currency was created 11 years ago, was likely to come in the form of loans.

"It could be voluntary loans from member states. That seems to be the best option," Tusk said.

A Spanish source told Reuters that details of the aid would be worked out at the latest by Tuesday, when EU finance ministers are due to hold a meeting.

"The general idea is to have broad European assistance with a tighter focus of assistance by euro zone countries," the source said, requesting anonymity. The European Commission would have a supervisory role over the aid deal.

European leaders are keen to prevent Greece's woes from spreading to other highly-indebted euro-zone members like Portugal or Spain, plunging the currency area into a bigger crisis that could reverberate around the globe.

TOUGH STEPS

But until this week, they have avoided speaking openly about the aid, fearful that might ease pressure on the government in Athens to enact tough austerity measures needed to bring down a deficit that soared to 12.7 percent of gross domestic product (GDP) last year -- more than four times EU limits.

Athens needs to borrow 53 billion euros ($75 billion) this year to cover its deficit and refinance debts. Its debt pile is expected to grow to more than 290 billion euros this year and the cost of servicing that debt has soared as bond markets have punished Greece for its financial profligacy.

The euro jumped versus the dollar after Van Rompuy announced a deal following the meeting of key euro zone leaders, also attended by Spanish Prime Minister Jose Luis Rodriguez Zapatero and Eurogroup Chairman Jean-Claude Juncker.

The premium investors demand to hold Greek government bonds rather than benchmark Bunds tightened 10 basis points on the news to 266 basis points, 17 basis points tighter on the day.

Greek spreads have narrowed from more than 400 basis points over Bunds in two weeks as momentum toward a bailout has gathered pace.

But markets remain wary amid uncertainty over the terms of the aid for Greece and how it might affect investor sentiment toward the 16-nation euro zone.

The euro stood at $1.3740 at 1200 GMT.

Even with EU support, the Greek government faces a daunting challenge to consolidate its budget and restore confidence in an economy whose imbalances were exacerbated by the economic and financial crisis.

Greek public sector union ADEDY said on Thursday it would join in a February 24 strike called by private sector union GSEE to protest government austerity measures, underscoring the risk that social unrest could hamper the Greek consolidation drive.

[Potemkin]

Soon, Germany is going to get tired of everyone sucking off the financial teat.

Eurozone "support" means money from Germany (or maybe some from France.)

[DReynolds]

And historically it doesn't end well when the Fatherland loses patience.

[Potemkin]

And historically it doesn't end well when the Fatherland loses patience.

Don't dance with the devil if you don't want to get burned.

The only one that gets the blame for the Greek situation is the Greeks. It must have been nice to run up the debt all of those years.

Now they have to pay.

[Dreamweaver]

Looks like the EU is following the path of least resistance as our own politicians are doing. They cannot or do not see beyond the next 3 months. Thus the reason we are all doomed.:D

[Glockd]

No, some of us are doomed, and some of us will continue to press on, sidestepping the small roadblocks in our paths. We may not be quite as comfortable as we are now, but we will make it.

[leistb]

Can one of the mods merge this thread into this one, http://thisbluemarble.com/showthread.php?t=24523 in Economy? I'd like to keep the info consolidated to track developments more easily.

Thanks,
leistb

[flourbug]

done

[leistb]

Thank you!

[leistb]

Angela Merkel Clanks When She Walks (http://market-ticker.org/archives/1961-Angela-Merkel-Clanks-When-She-Walks.html)

"Gee, it's all going to be ok and Germany is going to come to everyone's rescue!"
Nope. (http://www.guardian.co.uk/theguardian/2010/feb/11/germany-greece-merkel-bailout-euro)
Angela Merkel, the German chancellor, mounted stiff resistance tonight to any swift bailout of Greece, as a rift opened up between European capitals over how best to tackle the risks posed to the euro.

Despite a show of Franco-German unity on the crisis and the first statement from EU leaders pledging to safeguard the currency's stability, hopes on the markets of a German-led rescue plan to shore up Greece's critical public finances were dashed by Merkel, who repeatedly emphasised that Athens would need to put its own house in order and brushed aside all questions of financial support.
"See, I told you so (http://market-ticker.org/archives/1948-Hahahah...-Greecefire-Prompts-Intervention-Rumors.html). Twice (http://market-ticker.org/archives/1950-Is-That-A-Bailout-Or-A-Lit-Fuse.html)."
Someone forgot to tell the market pumpers (along with those who started buying Euros and Pounds against the dollar) that Greece is a bit player in this mess.

What 'ya gonna do about Ireland - a nation that has enough out there in bank debt to make Iceland look like a Girl Scout picnic? Or Spain? Portugal, which has had an actual failed bond auction already?

and

One would hope that Merkel and friends in Germany aren't really stupid enough to implement such a transfer of a peripheral nation's problem to the EU's core, but then again we have seen time and time again that "can-kicking" is the mantra of the world since this crisis began. Rather than deal with the underlying problems - excessive leverage, naked swaps that the seller can't possibly pay, various forms of fraud and gamesmanship in securities issue and similar - governments have instead decided to lift up the corner of the carpet and sweep, time and time again.

Should the EU implement this with Greece they may indeed set a precedent that could easily destroy the European Union over the next couple of years. Faced with Spain, Portugal, Italy and Ireland, all of which are huge problems compared to Greece both in terms of the debt outstanding and the size of their economies Germany will find itself unable to backstop all four nations - yet it will have to, once the die is cast with Greece.
It appears that unlike Barack Obama and Ben-d-you-over-the-table Bernanke, who doesn't much care about the formalities of what's supposed to be on The Federal Reserve's balance sheet, Angela Merkel has both a brain and she clanks when she walks!

I like it, although I'm not so sure that Ms. Merkel would be so steadfast had she not the benefit of watching other fools, specifically Henry Paulson, from afar, and thus got to see that the market always calls bluffs. She witnessed Fannie and Freddie's "Bazooka" and the non-bailout that was a bailout and then more bailout via TARP, AIG and others, and thus knows damn well that if she comes to the aid of Greece (assuming the German court system will let her) the PIIS (heh, that's a good acronym, no?), sans-Greece, will be there with hands outstretched instantly - and not by choice either.

Rather, the market will simply shift it's attention to Spain, Portugal, Ireland or all three, and place them under speculative attack until the story is repeated time and time again.

Germany simply lacks the ability to bail everyone out.

Our "officials" lacked the brainpower to recognize this even after having reality smash into their face at 450 mph in the form of a clue-by-four when Hank Paulson was so puerile as to threaten the market with his mighty "Bazooka".

He proceeded to blow off his own balls with that very bazooka just days later.

The market is bigger than any one man or any one nation and it does not suffer arrogance lightly. Virtually everyone who has tried to tangle with it has wound up with their head between their legs after not only their head was chopped off but both arms as well.

If Ms. Merkel has learned this lesson adequately from the last three years then progress has indeed been made. Perhaps she can put in a visit to Mr. Obama and whack him upside the head a few times, knocking some sense into that arrogant ass before he blows our nation to Hell with his belief that $1.6 trillion deficits are a "small mismatch" between spending and income - a mismatch that he largely created himself.

I wish Ms. Merkel luck dealing with her banks. Don't think for a minute that they're not neck-deep in the sludge themselves - they are - or that somehow they're so much wiser than us in the land of beer and schnitzel - they're not.

But when it comes to the consequences of "bailout world", it appears that Angela Merkel has learned from the experience of others, and as such, she deserves - at least for today - a gold star.

We'll see if I have to revoke it tomorrow.

http://market-ticker.org/

[Ross]

Madness .

Would you lend your own money to a heroin addict who refused
to quit or to a gambling addict who refused to stop ?

It would be the height of absurdity to lend Greece another
brass razoo before the Greeks implement reform.

[Potemkin]

Madness .

Would you lend your own money to a heroin addict who refused
to quit or to a gambling addict who refused to stop ?

It would be the height of absurdity to lend Greece another
brass razoo before the Greeks implement reform.

BBC had a good news report and interview on the issue.

The problem is market confidence of Eurozone (Not EU). Spain and Portugal are also on the brink.

If they don't get a handle on the situation, they are afraid confidence will fall, people will stop buying paper from Spain and Portugal, and the Euro will take a hit.

If the Euro takes a hit there will be a knock on effect of the other Eurozone economies who have switch from their country's currency.

(I am sure the UK Exchequer is silently praying "Thank God we never joined the Eurozone!")

[dharma]

This may be part of the interview you're talking about. Wanna see why governments hate speculators? Watch this to see a hedgie blow a Nobel-prizewinning "economist" out of the water, and in the process demonstrate the vacuity of government planning and thinking. Most entertaining thing I've seen in weeks:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E4MAifsp-8E

[Samen]

the process demonstrate the vacuity of government planning and thinking. Most entertaining thing I've seen in weeks:


From the video:
"The Germans do not honor Euros that are not issued by the Bundesbank."

Ahaa hah ha haa Germany has all the gold, All the gold transferred there from countries that joined the EU, thats where its stored and Euro is not backed up by gold. LOL

Yep. Total absence of matter from the governments.
Its getting scary in the methods of how the politicians in Europe are trying to escape responsibility, the big payoffs in brown envelopes can buy security fences and new laws to evade impeachment, have a feeling the bread and cake have been f..d up in their minds to a point that something is going to happen.

To a point that returning to the US is starting to feel comfortable.