Hospital food clichés ring true

[CanadaSue]

http://www.cbc.ca/news/health/story/...ital-food.html

Hospitals don't practice what they preach & their meal offerings aren't, (in general), high enough in calories or protein to optimize healing.

Here, food is prepared in another city, then trucked in. It's horrid to look it, doesn't smell appetizing & tastes horrible.

[Potemkin]

A relative was in the hospital food service industry as a kitchen manager.

The number one metric was food cost, ie the budget from the hospital finance directors.

Then the nutritionists comes in and tries to make it as nutritious as possible with the menu. (which is all computerized not to optimize cost. No real chefs are allowed because it would raise costs. "Here is the recipe for the menu today from the computer. Make it."

Then patients are taken into consideration.

Hospital food is often criticized for being unappetizing, but dietitians say the processed meals also lack proper nutrition for recovering patients.

In almost all places here, a registered dietician signs off on the menu..

[flourbug]

I remember giving birth (and ladies, you know how your stomach feels at that time) and about ten minutes later I was served a hot dog with sauerkraut. One, cheap, overboiled little hot dog on a stale bun with a huge pile of fresh from the can bitter sauerkraut. Tea AND coffee. The nurse was apologetic... everyone gets the same thing. Hot dogs with sauerkraut in a HOSPITAL? I couldn't imagine anyone who would want that.

Countryside Hospital (phenomenal hospital on all counts) provides patients with a restaurant type menu in a bound book. You can pick from 10 or so hot meals, or choose from a selection of soups, salads and sandwiches, and add in unlimited side dishes, desserts, and beverages. If you need special considerations, such as Kosher, Low Salt, no Dairy, Vegetarian, etc, you just click that box off on the menu. If you want a snack, or more food, or different food, they have room service! Just call and they'll bring it up. The food is excellent - and if you have someone staying in the room with you, you can buy from the same menu at a ridiculously low price (I forget the exact amount but it was something like $2.50).

[rb.]

Our hospital doesn't even have a cafeteria anymore, just a Tim Horton's. they get you coming and going. They cheap out on crappy food for patients, causing family to show up several times a day to bring them real food. And each time they show up it's $5 to park. $15 a day, just to BRING food to your loved one, never mind the actual cost of the food.

[Feather]

The hospital I worked in had decent food and it really paid to know all of the kitchen staff. When I was a patient DH worked in the kitchen of the same hospital. I had to have an echocardiogram and the dr had it down as NPO midnight and the test was at 1pm. When I got back I was so hungry. They let DH bring my tray up. All of the lunch food was gone so the chef fixed me a steak burger, the kitchen manager put two orders of fries on the tray. One of the gals put on a can of diet Pepsi and another gave me ice cream. I couldn't eat it all.

The hospital DH was in when he broke his back has a menue to chose from and he said it was good. It had to be better than the nasty crap they had when I was in there.

The hospital I was in for one of my surgeries was really good and the last hospital DH was in had good food.

I was so surprised that at one point we had chefs at two of the three hospitals.

[CanadaSue]

Ours has a cafeteria run by the Ladies' Auxilliary which has decent food - but it's not cheap. The new Tim Hortons kiosk is a licence to print money. Thank heavens for those... if you can get parking - a chronic issue at our hospital.

[NowVoyager]

Oak Hill and Bayonet where hubby's had his surgeries both had pretty darned good patient food. Least they did last time he was there.

Now for some really incredibly bad patient food, I'd have to say that the VA system is almost the worst of the worst.

Up in MN, the main hospital in Minneapolis had an incredible food court, which was hte saving grace when hubby was in there; mine too, as I had to stay in a pet friendly motel since we lived 150 miles away.

First meal hubby had he asked the food tech what it was, since neither smell or sight offered any clue.

Her reply after looking at it:

"It's either fried fish or meat loaf."

Went down to the food court and got hubby a great meal: fresh veggies, baked chicken and fruit.

Price was decent, too. Between the 'fast food' style offerings and the cafeteria style choices in the main line; one could eat balanced meals for a fair price.

The Tampa VA .... Well suffice to say they seem to take the outlook that if you're sick enough to be there, you're not going to care much about food.

Ever see the movie "City Slickers" ? The scene where Cookie describes the food they serve on the trail as 'Hot, brown and lots of it." ...... Substitute 'lukewarm' for hot and minimal and that about describes the VA patient meals. Even their coffee was bad. Seemed to be instant coffee that they saved from meal to meal and just dumped more hot water and coffee powder into the urn.

But Oak Hill, Bayonet and the new regional hospital, all offer good, balanced meals with choices for the various patient diets that are wholesome, well prepared and provide variety.

Best bet IMO is if one is in the hospital they need someone to not only be their advocate, but also able to spend as much time as possible with them, to help them.... Staffing being minimized to make budget and IMO the staff are overworked to handle their patient loads. Not their choice and they are IMNSO incredible folks who often aren't given their due for all they do.

Also, helps to have someone be able to bring in food for the patient. Sometimes something as simple as a cup of homemade soup and decent crackers tastes better and feeds both body and soul, for better healing.

[blue gecko]

Most hospitals are cash-strapped and see treating patients, rather than feeding them, as a priority. Hospitals devote about one per cent of their total budget to food, which breaks down to an average of $8 per patient a day.

One of the reasons I decided not to become a dietician after getting my degree was the inability to practice nutrition I knew was needed in a hospital situation. The menu restrictions are "canned" i.e low salt, low sugar, clear liquid etc and the dieticians hands are tied. They have a 4 year degree in Nutrition as compared to 1 maybe 2 classes taken by physicians and they are not allowed to practice their profession in any way other than overseeing the preparation of meals for sometimes hundreds of patients. That in itself is quite an undertaking and I can understand why they lean toward canned and processed foods. The study of Nutrition has come a long way since hospital standards were set and yet it is still regarded as an ugly stepchild when it comes to being an integral part of healing. I just can't understand it. How can something so important be neglected when it comes to patient care?

I worked in hospital dietetics for a time and realize how much effort it takes to prepare all those meals. I also understand what a difficult undertaking it would be to make the transition. But there are models out there that have successfully made that transition. I know there would be quite a bit of resistance to the change by the patients themselves in regard to soft drinks, white bread, sugary desserts etc but I say let their families bring them that kind of thing if they can't handle "real" food.

There is some headway being made in the larger institutions who have incorporated gluten-free kitchens, vegetarian kitchens etc as mini-restaurants throughout the complex. The last time my mom was in the hospital there were these kinds of of facilities. They were quite impressive. I can see where these micro kitchens could be used to help solve some of the problems by directing special dietary restrictions to that particular kitchen and thereby dividing the responsibility and ordering. Staff dieticians could then develop specialized menus prepared by the mini-kitchen's staff and delivered to patient's rooms. I know it would cost more but isn't it about time nutrition became a part of medical treatment plans?

[drummagick]

We have a large regional hospital here, and a small hospital attached to a regional clinic. I was in the smaller hospital for an overnight once and the food was not bad at all. That same place has a cafe for visitors and their food is pretty darn good and inexpensive. If I have to take one of the kids to the clinic around lunchtime we will go for lunch there. Same people cook for the cafe as cook for the hospital patients.

The large regional hospital's food is abysmal. There was a write up in the paper shortly after I moved here about how good it was, but that was 8 years ago and they must have really cut costs since then. I used to volunteer at a hospital in Seattle as a teenager and the food was wonderful, I'd have dinner there occasionally. I got nostalgic for this a few weeks ago and went up to the hospital cafeteria for dinner and it was horrible!

The best hospital food I've had was a little tiny place in Plain, MT. At least, the cafe food was good there. Had a wonderful sandwich on good whole grain bread. My friend I was picking up said the food she had while she was staying there was pretty good.

Before I moved here I was living in North Idaho and worked in Dietary at a 120 bed long term care facility. We cooked everything, no pre-made entrees or anything like that, and we did pretty good considering we had to stay within a certain budget. We really put in an effort to make things taste good and often this would cause us to be crunched for time, but it was worth it. Food was good enough that much of the evening crew would have their meals from us and we fed everyone the same things.

[jane333]

It's just so easy to fix healthy meals! Wash, slice and arrange fresh fruits and veggies on plate. Place small, fresh grilled or baked piece of meat/fish next to it. Done.

The problem, I'll bet, is the labor intensive nature of washing and cutting fresh foods.

When I was a substitute food service worker at our local school, everything came out of a package and got thrown into either the fryer or oven. NO fresh food of any kind was served except for salads that had been sent to us pre-made in plastic boxes. These rarely sold even tho hundreds of kids went through the lunch line.

The main offenders on their trays? Chicken nuggets, fries, hotdogs and burgers. And pizza.

I personally deep fried two cases of fries daily. It was sickening that the school allowed kids to spend lunch money on junk food, and I quit that job in disgust after about a month. Many kids were buying JUST fries and pop...every day.

[dharma]

Originally Posted by blue gecko

They have a 4 year degree in Nutrition as compared to 1 maybe 2 classes taken by physicians

Right. Wonder how many could make it through med school biochemistry. Not to minimize the job they do, but if you're going to compare someone's education to med school, be aware that's a very high bar.

When my sister-in-law was in the last two weeks of her pregnancy (IVF, triplet boys), she was strictly confined to bed rest in hospital. I came down to visit to find her crying hysterically and begging to be taken home. She couldn't move, she was bored, she was depressed, she was uncomfortable, and THE FOOD! It was terrible. She wasn't eating. She was vowing to crawl down to the lobby and call a cab if we didn't DO SOMETHING.

I took my brother out looking for options. She spent the rest of her pregnancy eating Chick Fil-A sandwiches (a nice big lump of tasty high quality protein), carrot or fruit salads (fiber, some vitamins, good taste and texture variation), and chocolate shakes (calories, calcium, and chocolate!). No, not a good long-term diet option, but she delivered three healthy boys and kept her sanity, and we slipped her some multivitamins.

People don't heal without nutrition. The problem is that those who really need it, the really sick ones, don't eat. It's a nightmare trying to keep someone with high requirements (e.g., burn patients) going on TPN, even these days.

[NowVoyager]

Originally Posted by dharma

Right. Wonder how many could make it through med school biochemistry. Not to minimize the job they do, but if you're going to compare someone's education to med school, be aware that's a very high bar.

When my sister-in-law was in the last two weeks of her pregnancy (IVF, triplet boys), she was strictly confined to bed rest in hospital. I came down to visit to find her crying hysterically and begging to be taken home. She couldn't move, she was bored, she was depressed, she was uncomfortable, and THE FOOD! It was terrible. She wasn't eating. She was vowing to crawl down to the lobby and call a cab if we didn't DO SOMETHING.

I took my brother out looking for options. She spent the rest of her pregnancy eating Chick Fil-A sandwiches (a nice big lump of tasty high quality protein), carrot or fruit salads (fiber, some vitamins, good taste and texture variation), and chocolate shakes (calories, calcium, and chocolate!). No, not a good long-term diet option, but she delivered three healthy boys and kept her sanity, and we slipped her some multivitamins.

People don't heal without nutrition. The problem is that those who really need it, the really sick ones, don't eat. It's a nightmare trying to keep someone with high requirements (e.g., burn patients) going on TPN, even these days.

Well said!!!!

The body needs good, wholesome food to run well and to heal. But the soul needs to be fed as well. Eye appeal and comforting aromas are important as well.

You and your brother did the best thing, helping his wife get good food that fed her and their babies bodies, but also fed her soul.

You're a good soul, dharma!

(great nic, btw )

[Catbird]

Originally Posted by blue gecko

There is some headway being made in the larger institutions who have incorporated gluten-free kitchens, vegetarian kitchens etc as mini-restaurants throughout the complex. The last time my mom was in the hospital there were these kinds of of facilities. They were quite impressive. I can see where these micro kitchens could be used to help solve some of the problems by directing special dietary restrictions to that particular kitchen and thereby dividing the responsibility and ordering. Staff dieticians could then develop specialized menus prepared by the mini-kitchen's staff and delivered to patient's rooms. I know it would cost more but isn't it about time nutrition became a part of medical treatment plans?

This is going to be an issue for me when I go in for my surgery. I react to a number of foods and I'm not sure that the hospital is equipped to deal with that. I'm going to be calling the Dietary department this week to discuss options. But we're expecting that I'll have to supply my own food. It's going to take a little thought as the hospital is a 2hour drive from home and DH will be staying in a hotel. But we'll figure it out.

I am curious to see if I get a reduction in my bill since I won't be eating the food. Yeah right.

But since dharma said chocolate shakes are an approved element of a hospital diet, I'll be sure that DH keeps me well supplied.

[jane333]

Chocolate is its own food group, of course. Right after guacamole.

[flourbug]

You can usually create a decent diet from hospital CAFETERIA food. Just bring a picnic basket full of spices, plastic utensils, bowls, and cups, a food chopper, and a whisk. Toss in a bunch of paper towels and baby wipes for cleaning faces and hands, and you're good to go.

I picked fruit out of the salad bar and dumped it on top of a container of yogurt. Top with crushed cookie. Chop up mixed veggies and meat to make them easier for the patient to eat. Orange juice and vanilla yogurt make a tasty drink when mixed together. They usually have apple juice and sweet tea available as well as milk and chocolate milk. If they have ice cream you can make your own milkshake. The staff is usually accommodating if you tell them you're feeding a patient. I even got chocolate syrup so I could dip the fresh strawberries my daughter brought to the hospital.

[CanadaSue]

When the time comes - this is an issue I'll have to consider with my patient... something I hadn't even thought about.

[blue gecko]

Right. Wonder how many could make it through med school biochemistry. Not to minimize the job they do, but if you're going to compare someone's education to med school, be aware that's a very high bar.

I understand what you're saying dharma and I can only base my opinion on personal experience. For me, Biochem was a prereq for Advanced Nutrition. I found Biochem quite interesting but Advanced Nutrition was the hardest class I took in college. Most of my classes were premed and they were tough going. Still I made it through 24 hours of Chemistry, 16 hours of microbiology, A&P (and again when I went through Massage school) and many other biology/fd science/nutrition courses. I also had the good fortune to go through the medtech program at a pathology lab and grew up with a Microbiologist for a father. It wasn't a slip shod education. Just out of curiosity, how many nutrition courses did you take in college and med school? I'm not trying to be impudent or disrespectful, just curious.

Doctors have so much on their plates when it comes to healing the sick. I can't imagine how difficult it is keeping up with new research and treatments. Thats where the concept of letting a qualified Nutritionist become a real and respected part of a treatment plan seems to me to be a worthy endeavor for all concerned.

[Catbird]

Originally Posted by flourbug

You can usually create a decent diet from hospital CAFETERIA food. Just bring a picnic basket full of spices, plastic utensils, bowls, and cups, a food chopper, and a whisk. Toss in a bunch of paper towels and baby wipes for cleaning faces and hands, and you're good to go.

I picked fruit out of the salad bar and dumped it on top of a container of yogurt. Top with crushed cookie. Chop up mixed veggies and meat to make them easier for the patient to eat. Orange juice and vanilla yogurt make a tasty drink when mixed together. They usually have apple juice and sweet tea available as well as milk and chocolate milk. If they have ice cream you can make your own milkshake. The staff is usually accommodating if you tell them you're feeding a patient. I even got chocolate syrup so I could dip the fresh strawberries my daughter brought to the hospital.

Those are great ideas fb.

There are usually 2 issues with getting food from someplace like that. One is potential cross-contamination and the other is "hidden" ingredients that a person might react to. Often, the cafeteria staff aren't aware of the ingredients in the items that they make or sell, so it's really buyer beware.

My usual standby is a plain baked potato. Sometimes with butter, if it's in its' own little package. If there is a baked potato "bar", I usually avoid the sour cream because it's sometimes a cheaper, sour cream-like product which often contains flour as a stabilizer. There are a lot of similar examples of hidden ingredients that can cause problems. But the fresh fruit and veggies are usually okay. And the pre-packaged things like yogurt and juice can be safe as well.

There's a website http://www.minimus.biz/ , where I can buy prepackaged mini's of lots of different products. They even have a GF soy sauce in little packets and Sunbutter, which I use in place of peanut butter. So I'll be getting some stuff from them to take to the hospital with me.

Hopefully, I'll only be there for a couple of days and, if necessary, I can live on chocolate shakes for that long!

[flourbug]

Allergies present a whole other issue.

Nurses often have a refrigerator on the floor for their own lunches and such. There's usually an area for patients as well, stocked with fruit juices, soda and water. I have had nurses offer to stash things I purchased in one of the refrigerators, and warm it in their microwave. Call ahead, talk to the floor nurse and explain your dietary needs, and see if they can accommodate a lunchbox for you.

[Feather]

A friend is allergic to wheat. She had to have a couple of polops removed from her colon and one of the meals they gave her had wheat in it some where. She blew up like a balloon. She gets hives and they travel. The meal that got her was a salad. Someone must have put crutons on it and then took them off. That's all it takes.

[dharma]

Originally Posted by blue gecko

I understand what you're saying dharma and I can only base my opinion on personal experience. For me, Biochem was a prereq for Advanced Nutrition. I found Biochem quite interesting but Advanced Nutrition was the hardest class I took in college. Most of my classes were premed and they were tough going.

BG, I have a degree in chemistry. I had chemistry through P Chem, biochem (a year), organic chem (did two semesters plus the labs in eight weeks one summer), etc. I had math through calculus and statistical analysis, plus liberal helpings of biology, physics, etc. A full boat, so if I didn't get into med school I could get a job as a chemist with an oil or pharmaceutical company. I don't know much chemistry anymore, but I thought I knew a lot when I graduated.

Ha. All largely useless. I very nearly flunked biochem my first year of med school.

Going from college courses to med school is like going from the go kart track my little nephews drive to Formula One. It is a completely different order of academia. Med school on paper is 25 hours of 600-800 level classes a semester, but that's crap—it's not that easy.

I took an anatomy course the last semester I was in college, just to do—I didn't need it to graduate. I was accepted halfway through, and decided to drop the course and take the rest of the year off, so I went to talk to the professor to get out of the class. When I explained why I was leaving he said, great! I'm going to be there with you, I was accepted to med school, too! (I remember thinking how ancient he was for med school, at 39, but that's another story. The arrogance of youth!)

I'll bet you see the punch line coming: this anatomy PhD almost failed med school anatomy (and biochem and physiology, all taught at the same time first semester even though any one of the three would constitute a pretty hefty load). It was a new world, and he wasn't ready for it—not that there's any way to prepare.

Med school is taught like it's life and death, because, someday, it will be. Forgive your doctor his rudeness when he rolls his eyes a bit after you tell him you "did pre-med". Cut him some slack when a chiropractor at a party says "we take all the same courses you do", and he stifles a giggle. Let it be when a nurse tries to compare her knowledge base to his and he just frowns.

It's like me telling a SEAL team member about my thrice-weekly workouts—he may listen politely, because he knows there's no way to explain the real thing to someone who hasn't done it, but he's not going to be impressed.

With all due respect!

/thread drift

[Mama Alanna]

The food in the Dover hospital a couple of months ago wasn't bad. My only complaint was the tea. Water had been heated in a carafe also used for coffee. Coffee drinkers appear not to know/notice that that the oils from coffee cannot be removed by ordinary dishwashing. If you are a coffee drinker and you think you don't like tea, because you think it tastes like really weak coffee? -- it doesn't. Not when the water is heated and poured from a source that has never had coffee to contaminate it. Other than being hot and brown, they have nothing in common. They're as different as milk and orange juice.

[CanadaSue]

***The growing movement to improve hospital food***


http://www.cbc.ca/news/health/story/...ital-food.html

[jane333]

Originally Posted by Feather

A friend is allergic to wheat. She had to have a couple of polops removed from her colon and one of the meals they gave her had wheat in it some where. She blew up like a balloon. She gets hives and they travel. The meal that got her was a salad. Someone must have put crutons on it and then took them off. That's all it takes.

Or maybe the vinegar in the dressing was made from wheat? Or they made a sandwich on the same cutting board on which they sliced the salad veggies?

Crazy hospital.

It's also odd to think that a person with severe food allergy would eat anything not prepared in her own home, by someone she trusts.

[Mama Alanna]

Originally Posted by jane333

Or maybe the vinegar in the dressing was made from wheat? Or they made a sandwich on the same cutting board on which they sliced the salad veggies?

Crazy hospital.

It's also odd to think that a person with severe food allergy would eat anything not prepared in her own home, by someone she trusts.

If you can't trust a hospital with a special non-allergenic meal, who can you trust?