Go Back   This Blue Marble, a Global Current Events Discussion Forum > Main Floor > Economy

Economy Economy discussion forum. Discuss the politics and effects of the general economy and global economic collapse here. Please keep all politics out of the Finance and Investment subforum.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 05-16-2009, 05:38 PM   #1
Ought Six
Dismember
 
Ought Six's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 35,164
Blog Entries: 15
Thanks: 178
Thanked 390 Times in 326 Posts
Arrow China says domestic demand can't fill export hole

China says domestic demand can't fill export hole


Reuters, via The Guardian
Friday May 15 2009


BEIJING -- China is trying to help its exporters, but global trade will shrink further and domestic demand cannot fully pick up the slack, the Ministry of Commerce said on Friday.

Chinese exports will remain subdued in coming months, though there are some positive signs, such as rising export orders, according to manufacturing sector surveys, ministry spokesman Yao Jian told a regular media briefing.

China said earlier this week that exports fell 22.6 percent in April from a year earlier, marking their sixth straight monthly decline.

"The priority now is to slow the decline in exports," Yao said. "We cannot compensate for a fall in external demand by simply expanding domestic demand."

When China's economy was expanding at a double-digit rate in recent years, analysts estimated that net exports contributed nearly one-third to GDP growth.

Growth is expected to slow to about 8 percent this year, with nearly all momentum coming from domestic consumption and massive government spending in the face of the economic crisis.

Yao said China would provide more insurance to exporters and try to ease the flow of goods through customs.

Since the onset of the slowdown in world trade last year, China has on multiple occasions increased tax refunds for exporters of goods from textiles to steel.

Yao said the average export-tax rebate stood at 12.4 percent now, compared with 9.8 percent before the crisis.

He added that there were indications that the deterioration in exports was tapering off, with a slower fall in exports from the Chinese trading hub of Guangdong.

But the overall picture remained bleak, he said.

"Exports will hover around a low level for a while," Yao said.
_____

(Reporting by Zhou Xin and Simon Rabinovitch; Editing by Ken Wills)

================================================== =

China Downplays Retail Sales Data


Andrew Batson
The Wall Street Journal -- China Journal blog
May 14, 2009


A new essay by one of China’s top statisticians provides a surprisingly frank accounting of some of the gaps in the nation’s regular economic indicators.

The unusual article by Xu Xianchun appears to be part of a recent push by the National Bureau of Statistics to provide more detailed and transparent economic data, which top leaders have told the bureau they need to make proper decisions.

The piece (in Chinese here) tries to explain why one can’t simply add up China’s monthly indicators of investment and spending to get an accurate picture of gross domestic product, the most common measure of overall economic performance. One of the trickiest areas to handle is household consumption, which in China is usually measured by monthly retail sales.

Nationwide retail sales for the first three months of 2009 were up 15% from a year earlier in nominal terms. But prices were down in that period, which means growth in real terms would be higher: 15.9%, according to the NBS. The data seem to point to a surprisingly fast expansion in consumption in the middle of China’s worst economic downturn in two decades, a picture that is backed up by accelerating sales of housing and automobiles.

Yet many economists have long felt that the retail sales figures are not a reliable guide to China’s household consumption. Mr. Xu himself notes these well-known gaps, pointing out that the official retail sales numbers include things that cannot be considered consumer spending.

The most important are retail sales to companies and institutions, which of course are not consumers at all, and sales of construction materials for housing, which should be counted as part of household investment. Retail sales also do not include spending on services like education or health care, or rural households’ consumption of produce they grow themselves, he notes.

“Compared with retail sales, using household consumption expenditure obtained from the rural and urban household surveys is closer to consumer spending,” Mr. Xu writes.

Those measures show much slower growth than the headline retail sales figure. Mr. Xu says the bureau’s household surveys put the real growth in urban household consumption in the first quarter at 9.6%, and 9.3% for rural households. That would mark somewhat faster growth than in the second half of 2008 but somewhat slower growth than in the first half, when food prices soared, according to figures previously released by the bureau.

Private-sector economists have their own worries about those surveys: though broad, they don’t appear to cover the highest- and lowest-income households very well. And the numbers they produce tend to be unusually volatile. Nevertheless, they do seem to get closer to the strict definition of consumption, at least as interpreted by the NBS.

Mr. Xu says the bureau’s preliminary estimate of the consumer spending component of GDP is of growth of “less than 9%” in real terms in the first quarter. “This is clearly lower than the growth rate of retail sales,” he writes. Unfortunately, he doesn’t indicate how it compares with previous quarters, making it hard to get an idea of how this measure has changed over time.

Though Mr. Xu is one of the deputy commissioners of the statistics bureau, his piece carried a disclaimer saying it represents his personal opinion and not the bureau’s official view.
__________________
* I have the right to live, thus I have the right to defend my life from attackers who would take it from me.
* I have the right to my private property, thus I have the right to defend my property from thieves who would take it from me.
* I have the right to self-determination, thus I have the right to defend my liberty from tyrants who would take it from me.
* The only usable tools for these tasks are guns, and thus I have the right to shoot anyone who would take my guns from me.

Last edited by Ought Six; 05-16-2009 at 05:46 PM.
Ought Six is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-16-2009, 08:03 PM   #2
Mama Alanna
First sign of spring
 
Mama Alanna's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: In front of the computer or the sewing machine.
Posts: 6,430
Thanks: 501
Thanked 950 Times in 468 Posts
Gee, how about that? China exports cheap, dangerous junk and once people wise up, they don't buy it!
__________________
~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
"The trouble with most folks isn't so much their
ignorance, as knowing so many things that ain't so."
--Josh Billings
~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
Mama Alanna is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-16-2009, 10:58 PM   #3
CanadaSue
SuperModerator
 
CanadaSue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: In my gardens or online
Posts: 26,035
Blog Entries: 28
Thanks: 955
Thanked 2,817 Times in 1,637 Posts
Low quality & limited dollars for imports - no brainer.
CanadaSue is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2009, 01:47 AM   #4
Sysiphus
Senior Level 5
 
Sysiphus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Seattle, Bastion of Liberalism
Posts: 6,378
Thanks: 91
Thanked 336 Times in 235 Posts
China may well be past its peak in terms of exports. From here, the cost of Chinese labor will only rise, and that generally means you will see a gradual shift of manufacturing to cheaper economies like India. The same thing happened to Japan, then Taiwan, then Korea. Like those economies, you will also see China shift to products that require less labor-intensive and more capital-intensive processes.
Sysiphus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2009, 02:27 AM   #5
Ross
Senior Level 6
 
Ross's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Melbourne Australia
Posts: 9,736
Thanks: 972
Thanked 1,500 Times in 850 Posts
Given the amount of raw materials the Chinese are currently importing
it appears their internal stimulus and infrastructure spending must have
swung in to top gear .

Probably because the Government is terrified of unpredictable
unemployment consequences ( just as the USA should be ) .


Quote:
February to April saw the highest amount of iron imported by China, including more than 45 million tons in April alone. That has chiefly propelled the rise in the Baltic Dry Index, with heavy activity reported on the Australia to China route.

Chinese buying of iron ore was predominantly stimulated by lowest prices in four years. The latest CIF (cost, insurance and freight) price for iron ore is $80 per ton, down about 35 per cent compared with last year.
http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/...ow/4531456.cms
Ross is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2009, 10:43 AM   #6
Fiddlerdave
Not Active
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 4,847
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by CanadaSue View Post
Low quality & limited dollars for imports - no brainer.
Sadly, some of the most precision and hi-tech industrial machinery I work with is made in China. They are wiping out the Germans in particular product areas, who had the lock on much of the stuff in my industry, but China matches quality, features, engineering for about 35% cheaper, minimum. The Germans gave up and moved most their manufacturing to China. There is a French manufacturer of one item but they will not last much longer. The USA hasn't made any if the stuff for a decade.

And the food and toys still comes from China - just relabeled so consumers dont know.

Their exports are down because the purchasing economies are down. I have seen little meaningful change except a few niches. In the huge name brands, where the numbers are, nothing has changed.

China is going to get the initial benefit of any economic recovery in the usA, or elsewhere in the world.
Fiddlerdave is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
china, demand, domestic, export, fill, hole

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:26 AM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright © Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.