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Old 09-13-2011, 05:56 PM   #1
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Default Turkey warns may launch ground raid in Northern Iraq

From Reuter's:

"Turkey warned on Tuesday that it was preparing a possible ground operation against Kurdish separatist militants in northern Iraq, depending on the result of talks with Iraq...
...Speculation that a ground offensive could be launched imminently was fueled on Monday when Prime Minister Tayyip Erdogan met military chiefs before leaving on a visit to Egypt."
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Old 09-13-2011, 09:51 PM   #2
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Oh great, another good excuse for gas prices to go up.
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Old 09-14-2011, 12:26 AM   #3
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Other raids have been launched into Iraq in the past, involving Turkish armored columns with air and artillery support.
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Old 09-14-2011, 04:04 AM   #4
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First of all I don't expect a move before 20th of September ...

Second, it has no relation with oil prices ...
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Old 09-14-2011, 09:54 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oric View Post
First of all I don't expect a move before 20th of September ...

Second, it has no relation with oil prices ...
Any increased instability in the middle east and any new violent conflict affects oil prices. Northern Iraq and some of the Kurdish areas have oil reserves that could end up being contested if a conflict were to broaden involving the Kurds.
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Old 09-14-2011, 01:29 PM   #6
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Yes, there are oil reserves but Turkey is performing operations on PKK, not N.Iraq Kurdish governance and usually with their consent. Such operations have been going on since 1990'ies and never has any effect on the region or oil. The reason why this operation issue is under spotlight is the tension with Israel, people have suddenly become more perceptive.
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Old 09-14-2011, 04:48 PM   #7
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Yes, there are oil reserves but Turkey is performing operations on PKK, not N.Iraq Kurdish governance and usually with their consent. Such operations have been going on since 1990'ies and never has any effect on the region or oil.
False.
---

Oil Prices Surge to Record Highs on Turkey-Iraq Tensions

Fears of an attack halting production in the oil-rich Kurdish region are largely responsible for sky-high prices.

Source: International Herald Tribune, via AlterNet -- October 16, 2007
---

Oil prices rise on supply jitters after Turkey enters Iraq

Source: China Daily -- 2008-02-23
---

If you just Google it, there are plenty more sources reporting the same story.
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Old 09-14-2011, 04:57 PM   #8
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I find the timing to be ironic and the action indicative of Turkey's hypocrisy.

"Let's kill the terrorists in our backyard but vote the ones in Israel's backyard into the UN".
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Old 09-14-2011, 05:08 PM   #9
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I find the timing to be ironic and the action indicative of Turkey's hypocrisy.

"Let's kill the terrorists in our backyard but vote the ones in Israel's backyard into the UN".
Some common statements about Israel and the 'Palestinians'....

The Palestinians just want their own homeland, and to govern themselves.

The Palestinians are bombed by the Israeli military.

The Palestinians are oppressed by the Israelis.

The Palestinians are discriminated against by the Israels.

.... apply equally well to Turkey and the Kurds.

The Kurds just want their own homeland, and to govern themselves.

The Kurds are bombed by the Turkish military.

The Kurds are oppressed by the Turks.

The Kurds are discriminated against by the Turks.

Funny how that works. It is almost as if the two situations are pretty much the same.
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Old 09-14-2011, 10:52 PM   #10
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One man's terrorist is the other man's freedom fighter.

I will not start writing how many times United States have taken the side of one or the other depending on its benefits ... That is called hypocrisy

As foe Kurds and Palestinians ...

Palestinians want their homeland, almost all of them are after freedom and independence.
Israel will not give them their independence and freedom unless forced by the world.

For Kurds; they have their political parties and we can easily see if the majority wants to secede or stay as part of Turkey. Today the seperatist movement is so far from getting a majority among their ethnic group. The day they are 51% they can really go their way. PKK is not only forcing Turkey but Kurds themselves against their will to stay together. Can you say Hamas or other Palestinian groups are forcing their nations to found a new state against their will to stay under israel occupation ? Certainly not ...

I will tell you this, things may go quiet the unusual way that you might wish them to. Kurds in iraq, syria and Turkey may form a federation with Turkey in the coming years. We will wait and see.
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Old 09-15-2011, 02:22 PM   #11
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I do hope you teach those commies a lesson.
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Old 09-15-2011, 02:33 PM   #12
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The Turks do need to form a good relationship with all the Kurds now.

From Spengler: http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Middle_East/MI13Ak01.html

Quote:
Turkey's economic problems are a discomfort; its ethnic problems, by contrast, present an existential threat in the long run. In a quarter of a century, Kurdish will be the cradle-tongue of nearly half of all Turkish children, as Kurds have four to five children per family while Turkish-speakers have just 1.5. At some point, Turkey in its present form will cease to exist. Kurdish nationalism is stronger than ever; as Omar Aspinar [1] of the Brookings Institution wrote on September 11 in Zaman Online:
Kurdish political aspirations have reached unprecedented levels in the last 10 years ... Kurdish ethnic, cultural and political demands are fueled by a young and increasingly resentful generation of Kurds who are vocal and frustrated not only in Eastern Anatolia but also in Turkey's large Western cities including Istanbul, Izmir, Mersin and Adana. Turkey's nightmare scenario is Turkish-Kurdish ethnic violence in such western urban centers.

The Kurds know that the demographic future belongs to them, and that Erdogan's frantic calls on Turkish women to have more babies will do nothing to change matters. "The Kurdish issue," warns Aspinar," remains Turkey's Achilles' heel."
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Old 09-15-2011, 03:04 PM   #13
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The only thing that will solve the problem is a creation of a Kurdish state that includes Kurdish territories in Iraq, Iran and Turkey.
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Old 09-15-2011, 05:03 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ought Six View Post
The only thing that will solve the problem is a creation of a Kurdish state that includes Kurdish territories in Iraq, Iran and Turkey.
Most probably you are correct, but it will be the Kurds' decision in the end. They will know what is best for themselves
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Old 09-15-2011, 05:07 PM   #15
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Most probably you are correct, but it will be the Kurds' decision in the end. They will know what is best for themselves
That is not exactly the position of the Turkish or Iranian governments, as you know.
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Old 09-15-2011, 05:11 PM   #16
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In a quarter of a century, Kurdish will be the cradle-tongue of nearly half of all Turkish children, as Kurds have four to five children per family while Turkish-speakers have just 1.5.
Families do not have many babies with imperial or hegemonial motives. It has been long observed that urbanization and rise of income levels, women in the workforce bring down birth rates and population growth. Same with the United States with African and Latin Americans ... Erdogan's repeated motivations for at least 3 children per family is more on the age demographics and economy related. Whether my grand grand children will speak Turkish, Kurdish or Farsi is non of my concern OOH

---------- Post added at 12:11 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:08 AM ----------

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That is not exactly the position of the Turkish or Iranian governments, as you know.
I can not speak for the Iranian government because I don't know ...
What Turkey is recently trying to promote is "living together as equal citizens with full cultural and language rights". Of course a state will be on the side of staying in unity, if the Kurds in Turkey want full independence I don't think anyone can stop them in the long run. Their choice will be harder then us, we know what we are going to gain or lose by such a seperation.
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Old 09-15-2011, 05:24 PM   #17
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I can not speak for the Iranian government because I don't know ...
What Turkey is recently trying to promote is "living together as equal citizens with full cultural and language rights". Of course a state will be on the side of staying in unity, if the Kurds in Turkey want full independence I don't think anyone can stop them in the long run. Their choice will be harder then us, we know what we are going to gain or lose by such a seperation.
So jailing Kurd journalists who write about separatism, criminalizing the use of the Kurd language for official purposes, banning the teaching of Kurdish children in their own language, and banning ethnic Kurdish political parties is Turkey's way of 'trying to promote is "living together as equal citizens with full cultural and language rights"'?
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* I have the right to my private property, thus I have the right to defend my property from thieves who would take it from me.
* I have the right to self-determination, thus I have the right to defend my liberty from tyrants who would take it from me.
* The only usable tools for these tasks are guns, and thus I have the right to shoot anyone who would take my guns from me.
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Old 09-15-2011, 05:36 PM   #18
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O6 : when you have a constitution written by a military junta, describing "turkishness" in every page, forming a judicial and educational system which favors turkish nationalism i can give you more bad examples of how we treat our Kurdish brothers as second class. When you try to change the constitution the protectors of the old system (military and bureacracy) either charge you with treason to the republic or you are taken down by a coup or be humiliated through deep state controlled media and lose elections. That was Turkey until 2002. I dont like Erdogan and AKP but they are really trying hard to change this self serving autocracy into a democracy. They have been accused of changing secular Turkey into an islamist state because they were against this autocracy. Yesterday erdogan made a speech in egypt and called egyptians to form a secular state, not an islamist one ! Anyway, kurds still recieve unequal trearment and are on trial because of the laws and constitution, these are all changing. They have to change, Turkey has no other alternative now.
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Old 09-25-2011, 03:33 PM   #19
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http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/...edd4fbf3cc3880

Turkey and Iran to cooperate in joint military operation against Kurdish rebels.
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Old 10-19-2011, 07:18 AM   #20
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Turkey Bombs Iraq PKK Bases:

Turkish jets launched air raids on suspected Kurdish rebel bases in northern Iraq on Wednesday

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/0..._n_929638.html
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